From z1693060 at students.niu.edu  Tue Mar  1 03:52:59 2016
From: z1693060 at students.niu.edu (Abraham Baker)
Date: Mon, 29 Feb 2016 20:52:59 -0600
Subject: ram
In-Reply-To: <20160229215848.GI4904@tonks>
References: <trinity-48790885-561f-435f-a078-cf8f36e48f7e-1456780710892@3capp-mailcom-bs09>
 <20160229215848.GI4904@tonks>
Message-ID: <CAJkSvUpww+2bNNpyDC74rvLrtBSsbYRGjXdoYEPH3ivCuJ1XBA@mail.gmail.com>

Sometimes if I use both firefox and qutebrowser at the same time (so I can
be logged into two gmail accounts at once for example), the RAM usage gets
high enough that swap starts being used (even though I have 8GB of ram).
This only happens if I have a lot of tabs open (especially if they're
media-rich sites like bandcamp), and I don't know which is necessarily to
blame.

I have also had some times where I suspended my computer every night for a
week, so I had >7 days of "uptime", and I ended up needing to restart
qutebrowser as the ram usage increased over time.

Next time I notice this I'll try to notice what's open and which browser is
using more memory.

Abe

On Mon, Feb 29, 2016 at 3:58 PM, Florian Bruhin <me at the-compiler.org> wrote:

> Hey,
>
> * Ibon Santisteban <OBIBON at gmx.com> [2016-02-29 22:18:30 +0100]:
> > First of all, I just discovered qutebrowser, and congratulations
> > (and thanks) for such a good piece of software.
>
> You're welcome!
>
> > I'm not really sure this is an issue, but I thought I rather say
> > something than not: I have the feeling that for a minimalistic
> > browser, it uses too much RAM. I just compared to other browsers and
> > this is what I got, having the same amount of tabs (five) open with
> > the exact same websites:
> >
> > midori: 154.8 MiB
> > otter browser: 286.6 MiB
> > qupzilla: 198.0 MiB
> > luakit: 375.7 MiB (even though it started at around 278, it increases as
> time goes by for some reason)
> > QUTEBROWSER: 587.9 MiB
>
> Hmm, interesting qutebrowser would use this much more RAM compared to
> Otter and QupZilla. What pages did you have open, and how precisely
> did you measure?
>
> (also note you're not subscribed to the list - I approved your posting
> by hand)
>
> Florian
>
> --
> http://www.the-compiler.org | me at the-compiler.org (Mail/XMPP)
>    GPG: 916E B0C8 FD55 A072 | http://the-compiler.org/pubkey.asc
>          I love long mails! | http://email.is-not-s.ms/
>
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From OBIBON at gmx.com  Wed Mar  2 20:48:13 2016
From: OBIBON at gmx.com (Ibon Santisteban)
Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2016 20:48:13 +0100
Subject: ram
In-Reply-To: <CAJkSvUpww+2bNNpyDC74rvLrtBSsbYRGjXdoYEPH3ivCuJ1XBA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <trinity-48790885-561f-435f-a078-cf8f36e48f7e-1456780710892@3capp-mailcom-bs09>
 <20160229215848.GI4904@tonks>,
 <CAJkSvUpww+2bNNpyDC74rvLrtBSsbYRGjXdoYEPH3ivCuJ1XBA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <trinity-d7a1257c-5045-4443-ae1a-b6b40b0ca403-1456948093561@3capp-mailcom-bs06>



The websites that I? had open were:
?
lxer.com
elcorreo.com
argia.eus
hoechberg.de
primewire.ag (the main website; I wasn't streaming anything yet)
?
To meassure I used ps_mem; a package from the Manjaro repositories. I could try other methods, but besides htop and conky I don't know how. Conky's overall RAM usage matched the one I got with ps_mem, but I don't have configured so that you can see the processes and how much they are using. I could do that for testing though, if it were of any help...

Unlike what Abe notes, I didn't notice any RAM increase over time. I do turn my computer off, but I was checking every 5 to 10 minutes or so for about an hour, and it was pretty consistent, as were also the other browsers, save for luakit.

Cheers,
obibon
?

Sent:?Tuesday, March 01, 2016 at 3:52 AM
From:?"Abraham Baker" <z1693060 at students.niu.edu>
To:?"Ibon Santisteban" <OBIBON at gmx.com>, qutebrowser at lists.qutebrowser.org
Subject:?Re: ram

Sometimes if I use both firefox and qutebrowser at the same time (so I can be logged into two gmail accounts at once for example), the RAM usage gets high enough that swap starts being used (even though I have 8GB of ram).? This only happens if I have a lot of tabs open (especially if they're media-rich sites like bandcamp), and I don't know which is necessarily to blame.
?
I have also had some times where I suspended my computer every night for a week, so I had >7 days of "uptime", and I ended up needing to restart qutebrowser as the ram usage increased over time.
?
Next time I notice this I'll try to notice what's open and which browser is using more memory.
?
Abe
?
On Mon, Feb 29, 2016 at 3:58 PM, Florian Bruhin <me at the-compiler.org> wrote:Hey,

* Ibon Santisteban <OBIBON at gmx.com[OBIBON at gmx.com]> [2016-02-29 22:18:30 +0100]:
> First of all, I just discovered qutebrowser, and congratulations
> (and thanks) for such a good piece of software.

You're welcome!

> I'm not really sure this is an issue, but I thought I rather say
> something than not: I have the feeling that for a minimalistic
> browser, it uses too much RAM. I just compared to other browsers and
> this is what I got, having the same amount of tabs (five) open with
> the exact same websites:
> ?
> midori: 154.8 MiB
> otter browser: 286.6 MiB
> qupzilla: 198.0 MiB
> luakit: 375.7 MiB (even though it started at around 278, it increases as time goes by for some reason)
> QUTEBROWSER: 587.9?MiB

Hmm, interesting qutebrowser would use this much more RAM compared to
Otter and QupZilla. What pages did you have open, and how precisely
did you measure?

(also note you're not subscribed to the list - I approved your posting
by hand)

Florian

--
http://www.the-compiler.org[http://www.the-compiler.org] | me at the-compiler.org[me at the-compiler.org] (Mail/XMPP)
? ?GPG: 916E B0C8 FD55 A072 | http://the-compiler.org/pubkey.asc[http://the-compiler.org/pubkey.asc]
? ? ? ? ?I love long mails! | http://email.is-not-s.ms/[http://email.is-not-s.ms/]


From me at the-compiler.org  Wed Mar  2 22:03:26 2016
From: me at the-compiler.org (Florian Bruhin)
Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2016 22:03:26 +0100
Subject: ram
In-Reply-To: <trinity-d7a1257c-5045-4443-ae1a-b6b40b0ca403-1456948093561@3capp-mailcom-bs06>
References: <trinity-48790885-561f-435f-a078-cf8f36e48f7e-1456780710892@3capp-mailcom-bs09>
 <20160229215848.GI4904@tonks>
 <CAJkSvUpww+2bNNpyDC74rvLrtBSsbYRGjXdoYEPH3ivCuJ1XBA@mail.gmail.com>
 <trinity-d7a1257c-5045-4443-ae1a-b6b40b0ca403-1456948093561@3capp-mailcom-bs06>
Message-ID: <20160302210326.GR4904@tonks>

Hey,

* Ibon Santisteban <OBIBON at gmx.com> [2016-03-02 20:48:13 +0100]:
> The websites that I? had open were:
> ?
> lxer.com
> elcorreo.com
> argia.eus
> hoechberg.de
> primewire.ag (the main website; I wasn't streaming anything yet)
> ?
> To meassure I used ps_mem; a package from the Manjaro repositories.
> I could try other methods, but besides htop and conky I don't know
> how. Conky's overall RAM usage matched the one I got with ps_mem,
> but I don't have configured so that you can see the processes and
> how much they are using. I could do that for testing though, if it
> were of any help...

I tried to reproduce this, with a freshly opened instance, and
measuring qutebrowser's RAM usage after all pages were loaded.
I get 310 MB (rather than your 588 MiB), and 318 MB with Otter.

I'm wondering, does it look the same for you when you launch with
--temp-basedir?

Florian

-- 
http://www.the-compiler.org | me at the-compiler.org (Mail/XMPP)
   GPG: 916E B0C8 FD55 A072 | http://the-compiler.org/pubkey.asc
         I love long mails! | http://email.is-not-s.ms/
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From OBIBON at gmx.com  Wed Mar  2 22:30:03 2016
From: OBIBON at gmx.com (Ibon Santisteban)
Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2016 22:30:03 +0100
Subject: ram
In-Reply-To: <20160302210326.GR4904@tonks>
References: <trinity-48790885-561f-435f-a078-cf8f36e48f7e-1456780710892@3capp-mailcom-bs09>
 <20160229215848.GI4904@tonks>
 <CAJkSvUpww+2bNNpyDC74rvLrtBSsbYRGjXdoYEPH3ivCuJ1XBA@mail.gmail.com>
 <trinity-d7a1257c-5045-4443-ae1a-b6b40b0ca403-1456948093561@3capp-mailcom-bs06>,
 <20160302210326.GR4904@tonks>
Message-ID: <trinity-6bfad4ea-1653-48bf-8b4b-01a51b08755c-1456954202872@3capp-mailcom-bs06>

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From z1693060 at students.niu.edu  Sun Mar  6 04:36:14 2016
From: z1693060 at students.niu.edu (Abraham Baker)
Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2016 21:36:14 -0600
Subject: Wikipedia page?
Message-ID: <CAJkSvUrD2HP30=_jw_MD8camHh2MpjCUT8VD0oZD+xF=yPWSmA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

I just made a wikipedia account to fix a mistake on an unrelated page, and
I realized that there's no wikipedia page for qutebrowser yet.

There are lots of pages about other open-source browsers, as well as
userboxes for them.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_web_browsers

Should there be a page and/or a userbox for qutebrowser?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Userboxes/Browsers

Abe
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From me at the-compiler.org  Sun Mar  6 16:40:48 2016
From: me at the-compiler.org (Florian Bruhin)
Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2016 16:40:48 +0100
Subject: Wikipedia page?
In-Reply-To: <CAJkSvUrD2HP30=_jw_MD8camHh2MpjCUT8VD0oZD+xF=yPWSmA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJkSvUrD2HP30=_jw_MD8camHh2MpjCUT8VD0oZD+xF=yPWSmA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20160306154048.GN4904@tonks>

Hey,

* Abraham Baker <z1693060 at students.niu.edu> [2016-03-05 21:36:14 -0600]:
> I just made a wikipedia account to fix a mistake on an unrelated page, and
> I realized that there's no wikipedia page for qutebrowser yet.
> 
> There are lots of pages about other open-source browsers, as well as
> userboxes for them.
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_web_browsers
> 
> Should there be a page and/or a userbox for qutebrowser?
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Userboxes/Browsers

If someone steps up to write and maintain a page which won't end up
getting marked as irrelevant/stub - sure, go ahead!
I know I won't try ;)

Florian

-- 
http://www.the-compiler.org | me at the-compiler.org (Mail/XMPP)
   GPG: 916E B0C8 FD55 A072 | http://the-compiler.org/pubkey.asc
         I love long mails! | http://email.is-not-s.ms/
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From me at the-compiler.org  Mon Mar  7 09:12:40 2016
From: me at the-compiler.org (Florian Bruhin)
Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2016 09:12:40 +0100
Subject: RFC - Doing a crowdfunding for QtWebEngine in qutebrowser?
Message-ID: <20160307081240.GA11428@tonks>

Hi!

(Warning, somewhat long mail ahead - tl;dr: I'm thinking about doing a
crowdfunding to work full-time on qutebrowser for a while, and I'm
trying to collect thoughts and opinions on that)

As some of you might know, over the past few months I've mostly been
working on qutebrowser's testsuite to prepare for the upcoming
integration of QtWebEngine, the new backend based on Chromium.

Since last year, I've brought the test coverage up from something like
20% to 77%, and now I hope there won't be too much left until I feel
confident starting to work on QtWebEngine support.

QtWebEngine will bring many improvements to qutebrowser in various
areas - compatibility, stability, and security. This is due to it
being based on a modern Chromium instead of using an oudated WebKit as
backend.

However, this is a major undertaking. While I had plans to switch to
QtWebEngine since day one, I didn't anticipate it would be as
backwards-incompatible as it is (and I think neither did Qt people,
back then).



Right now, I can only work on qutebrowser quite fragmented. Most of
the stuff happens in the 2 hours I drive per day in public transports,
with multiple distractions (due to switching trains) in between. I
found it very hard to work on bigger things in qutebrowser that way.

Twice I took time off from work to be able to do more focused work.
Once before the v0.1 release, and once somewhat recently to work on
tests.

Inspired by pytest doing a fundraiser for a sprint, I looked at a
topic I had in the back of my mind for some while already: Collecting
some money so I can work on qutebrowser full-time, ideally for a
timespan between 2 weeks and 2 months.

It's not like I plan to stop working on qutebrowser in my free time,
it's just much easier when I can do so for hours without being
interrupted rather than minutes. QtWebEngine will come either way, but
it'll come a lot faster with your help!

As mentioned I mainly plan to work on QtWebEngine in that time, but if
time permits, there are other big undertakings (like config
adjustments to allow for per-domain settings) waiting to be tackled.



Since I'm saving for starting to study later this year, I won't be
able to do this without any income at all, however.

After some thinking about this, I'd need to have something like
3000 CHF per month to be able to follow those plans.

If you wanted to exchange your local currency to that, that'd be
about:

- 2800 EUR
- 2100 GBP
- 3000 USD

... I know this is probably sounding like a lot of money.

The problem is, living in Switzerland is quite expensive, and what
you'd probably consider quite a good salary is really modest here.

Adjusting the amounts based on the "location factors"[1] (which I
believe are a quite reasonable combination of various sources) yields
the following results[2]:

- 1300 EUR (assuming you're living in Germany)
- 1200 GBP
- 2300 USD

So what I thought about is doing a "flexible funding" campaign with
the goal of probably 3000 EUR, which translates to a month of
full-time work on qutebrowser.

If there's less than that, I'll get the money either way, and work
less time. If there's more, I'll be able to work on it longer (up to
something like 7500 EUR, i.e. 2.5 months).

In exchange, I could provide some schwag, like qutebrowser stickers
and t-shirts.



I realize this is quite crazy, and - also due to the lack of cooperate
backers - I'm really not sure what to expect, this is more of a
(public) thought experiment for now.

This is why I'd appreciate hearing any comments and thoughts you all
have on that matter - whether you know about similar projects which
did such a thing in the past, or you think this is completely crazy,
or you dislike the idea in general.

Also, if you think you'd donate to the cause, please let me know as
well!

Feel free to reply to me privately/off-list too.

Thanks,

Florian

[1] http://location.rkh.im/
[2] http://location.rkh.im/calculator/DE;US;GB;CH/3k?time_unit=month&base=CH

-- 
http://www.the-compiler.org | me at the-compiler.org (Mail/XMPP)
   GPG: 916E B0C8 FD55 A072 | http://the-compiler.org/pubkey.asc
         I love long mails! | http://email.is-not-s.ms/
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From mel at thestack.co  Mon Mar  7 12:39:22 2016
From: mel at thestack.co (Mel Boyce)
Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2016 22:39:22 +1100
Subject: RFC - Doing a crowdfunding for QtWebEngine in qutebrowser?
In-Reply-To: <20160307081240.GA11428@tonks>
References: <20160307081240.GA11428@tonks>
Message-ID: <1457350762.3381495.541699722.4754FECC@webmail.messagingengine.com>

On Mon, Mar 7, 2016, at 19:12, Florian Bruhin wrote:
> - 2800 EUR
> - 2100 GBP
> - 3000 USD

USD$10 from 300 people sounds manageable in exchange for modernizing a
web browser of this caliber.


From me at the-compiler.org  Mon Mar  7 12:44:35 2016
From: me at the-compiler.org (Florian Bruhin)
Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2016 12:44:35 +0100
Subject: RFC - Doing a crowdfunding for QtWebEngine in qutebrowser?
In-Reply-To: <1457350762.3381495.541699722.4754FECC@webmail.messagingengine.com>
References: <20160307081240.GA11428@tonks>
 <1457350762.3381495.541699722.4754FECC@webmail.messagingengine.com>
Message-ID: <20160307114435.GC11428@tonks>

* Mel Boyce <mel at thestack.co> [2016-03-07 22:39:22 +1100]:
> On Mon, Mar 7, 2016, at 19:12, Florian Bruhin wrote:
> > - 2800 EUR
> > - 2100 GBP
> > - 3000 USD
> 
> USD$10 from 300 people sounds manageable in exchange for modernizing a
> web browser of this caliber.

Hmm, I doubt that. Hell, I'm not even sure it has 300 users.
Unfortunately, those things are quite hard to predict/measure.

I guess in the end I'll just have to try and see what happens ;)

Florian

-- 
http://www.the-compiler.org | me at the-compiler.org (Mail/XMPP)
   GPG: 916E B0C8 FD55 A072 | http://the-compiler.org/pubkey.asc
         I love long mails! | http://email.is-not-s.ms/
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From chris at dejimata.com  Mon Mar  7 15:36:08 2016
From: chris at dejimata.com (Chris Salzberg)
Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2016 23:36:08 +0900
Subject: RFC - Doing a crowdfunding for QtWebEngine in qutebrowser?
In-Reply-To: <20160307114435.GC11428@tonks>
References: <20160307081240.GA11428@tonks>
 <1457350762.3381495.541699722.4754FECC@webmail.messagingengine.com>
 <20160307114435.GC11428@tonks>
Message-ID: <20160307143608.umjlqwd26ppcxhum@chris-XPS13-9333.localdomain>

Hi Florian,

Just one user here, but I'd be more than happy to put forward serious 
money to get the QtWebEngine work done, say USD$100+ if it helps. And I 
doubt that I'm the only one.

The reason is simple: there are a lot of people out there who want a 
powerful, minimal vim-like browser, but you just can't buy them, no 
matter how much money you have! You have to just hope that somebody else 
builds it, or build it yourself.

For those of us who don't have time or skills to build a browser like 
qutebrowser (i.e. pretty much everybody), putting forward a bit of money 
to support your (very modest) request seems like a real bargain. (Not to 
mention how minuscule this amount of money is compared to what goes into 
building a mainstream browser!)

Even if (as you think) the community of qutebrowser users is small, for 
the reasons above, a crowdfunding call might work well and bring you 
more results than you'd think. It gives everybody a chance to support a 
really important step (QtWebEngine integration) which everybody agrees 
needs to happen, but which everybody also agrees will not be easy.

I consider having a good browser up there in importance with having a 
good code editor. But whereas editors get lots of attention from 
developers, it seems like everybody is just happy to use Chrome or 
Firefox with whatever hacky plugin on top to do what they need...  which 
I think is crazy! I want something better than that. Qutebrowser is 
*very* close to the perfect browser for me.

So count me in! And be ambitious with the crowdfunding drive. I think 
there's more support out there than you think.

Chris

p.s. As an example of a similar crowdfunding drive that raised quite a 
large amount of money, see git-annex assistant:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/joeyh/git-annex-assistant-like-dropbox-but-with-your-own


On 03/07 at 12:44, Florian Bruhin wrote:
>* Mel Boyce <mel at thestack.co> [2016-03-07 22:39:22 +1100]:
>> On Mon, Mar 7, 2016, at 19:12, Florian Bruhin wrote:
>> > - 2800 EUR
>> > - 2100 GBP
>> > - 3000 USD
>>
>> USD$10 from 300 people sounds manageable in exchange for modernizing a
>> web browser of this caliber.
>
>Hmm, I doubt that. Hell, I'm not even sure it has 300 users.
>Unfortunately, those things are quite hard to predict/measure.
>
>I guess in the end I'll just have to try and see what happens ;)
>
>Florian
>
>-- 
>http://www.the-compiler.org | me at the-compiler.org (Mail/XMPP)
>   GPG: 916E B0C8 FD55 A072 | http://the-compiler.org/pubkey.asc
>         I love long mails! | http://email.is-not-s.ms/




From z1693060 at students.niu.edu  Tue Mar  8 14:40:47 2016
From: z1693060 at students.niu.edu (Abraham Baker)
Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2016 07:40:47 -0600
Subject: :wq and restart not working as expected
Message-ID: <CAJkSvUqRL3PQzwZ3EJMvmoO0gP6FZHw9G2ksYAni7WTMjLh+wA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

When I close qutebrowser with :wq and then restart it after restarting the
computer, all of my previously opened tabs remain shown, but fail to load.

If I try to reload those tabs or close and reopen them, they just dissapear.

I do not have any kind of auto-history clearing script yet (I just do that
manually every so often), so I don't think loss of history is the issue.*

Is there something possibly on my end of this that could prevent those tabs
from reopening properly?

Thanks,
Abe


*I like how transparent history logging is in this browser, making it easy
to search through and manage.
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From me at the-compiler.org  Tue Mar  8 14:50:50 2016
From: me at the-compiler.org (Florian Bruhin)
Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2016 14:50:50 +0100
Subject: :wq and restart not working as expected
In-Reply-To: <CAJkSvUqRL3PQzwZ3EJMvmoO0gP6FZHw9G2ksYAni7WTMjLh+wA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJkSvUqRL3PQzwZ3EJMvmoO0gP6FZHw9G2ksYAni7WTMjLh+wA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20160308135050.GG11428@tonks>

Hey,

* Abraham Baker <z1693060 at students.niu.edu> [2016-03-08 07:40:47 -0600]:
> When I close qutebrowser with :wq and then restart it after restarting the
> computer, all of my previously opened tabs remain shown, but fail to load.

What does "fail to load" mean exactly? Do they stay blank? Display an
error? Does this always happen?

Can you do :report after it happens so I get a debug log with the
information necessary to investigate this?

> *I like how transparent history logging is in this browser, making it easy
> to search through and manage.

Yeah - I hope I'll be able to stick to that even with QtWebEngine,
which is a bit more integrated. It's definitely a feature I like as
well :)

Florian

-- 
http://www.the-compiler.org | me at the-compiler.org (Mail/XMPP)
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From z1693060 at students.niu.edu  Tue Mar  8 14:52:53 2016
From: z1693060 at students.niu.edu (Abraham Baker)
Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2016 07:52:53 -0600
Subject: :wq and restart not working as expected
In-Reply-To: <20160308135050.GG11428@tonks>
References: <CAJkSvUqRL3PQzwZ3EJMvmoO0gP6FZHw9G2ksYAni7WTMjLh+wA@mail.gmail.com>
 <20160308135050.GG11428@tonks>
Message-ID: <CAJkSvUrRtGAu931HUZiWi-0bDNZ4sWNzFmtCC8Q2oeNj+D+NMg@mail.gmail.com>

That was fast!

"fail to load" = stay blank, appear to be 10% done loading but never
finishing. "r" has no effect, and d followed by u just re-opens the most
recently closed tab from the *current *session.

I'll do a report next time I reboot, which will be later today.



On Tue, Mar 8, 2016 at 7:50 AM, Florian Bruhin <me at the-compiler.org> wrote:

> Hey,
>
> * Abraham Baker <z1693060 at students.niu.edu> [2016-03-08 07:40:47 -0600]:
> > When I close qutebrowser with :wq and then restart it after restarting
> the
> > computer, all of my previously opened tabs remain shown, but fail to
> load.
>
> What does "fail to load" mean exactly? Do they stay blank? Display an
> error? Does this always happen?
>
> Can you do :report after it happens so I get a debug log with the
> information necessary to investigate this?
>
> > *I like how transparent history logging is in this browser, making it
> easy
> > to search through and manage.
>
> Yeah - I hope I'll be able to stick to that even with QtWebEngine,
> which is a bit more integrated. It's definitely a feature I like as
> well :)
>
> Florian
>
> --
> http://www.the-compiler.org | me at the-compiler.org (Mail/XMPP)
>    GPG: 916E B0C8 FD55 A072 | http://the-compiler.org/pubkey.asc
>          I love long mails! | http://email.is-not-s.ms/
>
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From tomas at orsava.cz  Thu Mar 10 14:39:11 2016
From: tomas at orsava.cz (=?UTF-8?B?VG9tw6HFoSBPcnNhdmE=?=)
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2016 14:39:11 +0100
Subject: RFC - Doing a crowdfunding for QtWebEngine in qutebrowser?
In-Reply-To: <20160307143608.umjlqwd26ppcxhum@chris-XPS13-9333.localdomain>
References: <20160307081240.GA11428@tonks>
 <1457350762.3381495.541699722.4754FECC@webmail.messagingengine.com>
 <20160307114435.GC11428@tonks>
 <20160307143608.umjlqwd26ppcxhum@chris-XPS13-9333.localdomain>
Message-ID: <CAOkyep44JrS=Dkhsm9DugkCs1cY+NfoRUDVkzLxX-vzBe4GQ4Q@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Florian,
definitively go for it, I think a lot of people are interested in this
little browser.
And if you provide a Bitcoin wallet address to donate that way, that would
be great!

Tomas

On 7 March 2016 at 15:36, Chris Salzberg <chris at dejimata.com> wrote:

> Hi Florian,
>
> Just one user here, but I'd be more than happy to put forward serious
> money to get the QtWebEngine work done, say USD$100+ if it helps. And I
> doubt that I'm the only one.
>
> The reason is simple: there are a lot of people out there who want a
> powerful, minimal vim-like browser, but you just can't buy them, no matter
> how much money you have! You have to just hope that somebody else builds
> it, or build it yourself.
>
> For those of us who don't have time or skills to build a browser like
> qutebrowser (i.e. pretty much everybody), putting forward a bit of money to
> support your (very modest) request seems like a real bargain. (Not to
> mention how minuscule this amount of money is compared to what goes into
> building a mainstream browser!)
>
> Even if (as you think) the community of qutebrowser users is small, for
> the reasons above, a crowdfunding call might work well and bring you more
> results than you'd think. It gives everybody a chance to support a really
> important step (QtWebEngine integration) which everybody agrees needs to
> happen, but which everybody also agrees will not be easy.
>
> I consider having a good browser up there in importance with having a good
> code editor. But whereas editors get lots of attention from developers, it
> seems like everybody is just happy to use Chrome or Firefox with whatever
> hacky plugin on top to do what they need...  which I think is crazy! I want
> something better than that. Qutebrowser is *very* close to the perfect
> browser for me.
>
> So count me in! And be ambitious with the crowdfunding drive. I think
> there's more support out there than you think.
>
> Chris
>
> p.s. As an example of a similar crowdfunding drive that raised quite a
> large amount of money, see git-annex assistant:
>
>
> https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/joeyh/git-annex-assistant-like-dropbox-but-with-your-own
>
>
>
> On 03/07 at 12:44, Florian Bruhin wrote:
>
>> * Mel Boyce <mel at thestack.co> [2016-03-07 22:39:22 +1100]:
>>
>>> On Mon, Mar 7, 2016, at 19:12, Florian Bruhin wrote:
>>> > - 2800 EUR
>>> > - 2100 GBP
>>> > - 3000 USD
>>>
>>> USD$10 from 300 people sounds manageable in exchange for modernizing a
>>> web browser of this caliber.
>>>
>>
>> Hmm, I doubt that. Hell, I'm not even sure it has 300 users.
>> Unfortunately, those things are quite hard to predict/measure.
>>
>> I guess in the end I'll just have to try and see what happens ;)
>>
>> Florian
>>
>> --
>> http://www.the-compiler.org | me at the-compiler.org (Mail/XMPP)
>>   GPG: 916E B0C8 FD55 A072 | http://the-compiler.org/pubkey.asc
>>         I love long mails! | http://email.is-not-s.ms/
>>
>
>
>
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From tomas at orsava.cz  Thu Mar 10 22:51:36 2016
From: tomas at orsava.cz (=?UTF-8?B?VG9tw6HFoSBPcnNhdmE=?=)
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2016 22:51:36 +0100
Subject: Remapping Escape
Message-ID: <CAOkyep7L0i+72G8SO9y+4-LBLR8wz8u9qhVHER__T1BTap4vzQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Florian,

I recently mapped the letters "jk" to Escape in vim, as it has numerous
advantages: http://learnvimscriptthehardway.stevelosh.com/chapters/10.html

However, I'm failing to do likewise in qutebrowser, here's my keys.conf:

[!normal]

clear-keychain ;; leave-mode
    jk
    <Escape>
    <Ctrl-[>

This sadly does not work (at least not from insert mode where I need it).
Am I doing something wrong, or is this not possible in qutebrowser as of
yet?

Thanks for your time
Tomas Orsava
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From ryan at rcorre.net  Fri Mar 11 03:08:43 2016
From: ryan at rcorre.net (Ryan Roden-Corrent)
Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2016 21:08:43 -0500
Subject: qutebrowser and Github
Message-ID: <20160311020843.GA554@zen-arch>

I remember a while back a mail went around about qutebrowser having trouble with
Github's web UI. Has anyone tried contacting their support about this? I did,
and was told they couldn't repro it. I just waited figuring the problem would
sort itself out eventually, but it still hasn't. In particular, I need to launch
chromium every time I want to open a PR because the buttons and dropdowns don't
work in qutebrowser. For those that weren't following this, there _was_ a time
when it worked, but it hasn't for a while (months, maybe?).

-Ryan


From me at the-compiler.org  Fri Mar 11 06:36:05 2016
From: me at the-compiler.org (Florian Bruhin)
Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2016 06:36:05 +0100
Subject: qutebrowser and Github
In-Reply-To: <20160311020843.GA554@zen-arch>
References: <20160311020843.GA554@zen-arch>
Message-ID: <20160311053605.GO11428@tonks>

* Ryan Roden-Corrent <ryan at rcorre.net> [2016-03-10 21:08:43 -0500]:
> I remember a while back a mail went around about qutebrowser having trouble with
> Github's web UI. Has anyone tried contacting their support about this? I did,
> and was told they couldn't repro it. I just waited figuring the problem would
> sort itself out eventually, but it still hasn't. In particular, I need to launch
> chromium every time I want to open a PR because the buttons and dropdowns don't
> work in qutebrowser. For those that weren't following this, there _was_ a time
> when it worked, but it hasn't for a while (months, maybe?).

After some people contacted support, it worked again after a few
days - but only if you set your user-agent to the default.

Not sure what weird stuff they do, but things are going to get better
with QtWebEngine in the future either way.

Florian

-- 
http://www.the-compiler.org | me at the-compiler.org (Mail/XMPP)
   GPG: 916E B0C8 FD55 A072 | http://the-compiler.org/pubkey.asc
         I love long mails! | http://email.is-not-s.ms/
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From me at the-compiler.org  Fri Mar 11 06:38:29 2016
From: me at the-compiler.org (Florian Bruhin)
Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2016 06:38:29 +0100
Subject: Remapping Escape
In-Reply-To: <CAOkyep7L0i+72G8SO9y+4-LBLR8wz8u9qhVHER__T1BTap4vzQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAOkyep7L0i+72G8SO9y+4-LBLR8wz8u9qhVHER__T1BTap4vzQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20160311053829.GP11428@tonks>

Hey,

* Tom?? Orsava <tomas at orsava.cz> [2016-03-10 22:51:36 +0100]:
> I recently mapped the letters "jk" to Escape in vim, as it has numerous
> advantages: http://learnvimscriptthehardway.stevelosh.com/chapters/10.html

I just mapped capslock to esc via xmodmap ;)

> This sadly does not work (at least not from insert mode where I need it).
> Am I doing something wrong, or is this not possible in qutebrowser as of
> yet?

You can currently only bind special chars (i.e. non-alphanumeric ones,
or involving a modifier) in insert mode, yeah.

There is an issue for it though:
https://github.com/The-Compiler/qutebrowser/issues/1044

Florian

-- 
http://www.the-compiler.org | me at the-compiler.org (Mail/XMPP)
   GPG: 916E B0C8 FD55 A072 | http://the-compiler.org/pubkey.asc
         I love long mails! | http://email.is-not-s.ms/
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From chris at dejimata.com  Fri Mar 11 07:49:19 2016
From: chris at dejimata.com (Chris Salzberg)
Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2016 15:49:19 +0900
Subject: qutebrowser and Github
In-Reply-To: <20160311053605.GO11428@tonks>
References: <20160311020843.GA554@zen-arch>
 <20160311053605.GO11428@tonks>
Message-ID: <20160311064919.sjmt4gr4sfsdmndo@chris-XPS13-9333-work>

FWIW, I found that if I set my user-agent to the default github sort of 
works, but still it's really sluggish when switching tabs and I find I 
often have to reload the page to see what I want to see.

It's annoying that companies like Github who should know better make 
their interface so dependent on your user-agent...

Looking forward to QtWebEngine!!! ;)

On 03/11 at 06:36, Florian Bruhin wrote:
>* Ryan Roden-Corrent <ryan at rcorre.net> [2016-03-10 21:08:43 -0500]:
>> I remember a while back a mail went around about qutebrowser having trouble with
>> Github's web UI. Has anyone tried contacting their support about this? I did,
>> and was told they couldn't repro it. I just waited figuring the problem would
>> sort itself out eventually, but it still hasn't. In particular, I need to launch
>> chromium every time I want to open a PR because the buttons and dropdowns don't
>> work in qutebrowser. For those that weren't following this, there _was_ a time
>> when it worked, but it hasn't for a while (months, maybe?).
>
>After some people contacted support, it worked again after a few
>days - but only if you set your user-agent to the default.
>
>Not sure what weird stuff they do, but things are going to get better
>with QtWebEngine in the future either way.
>
>Florian
>
>-- 
>http://www.the-compiler.org | me at the-compiler.org (Mail/XMPP)
>   GPG: 916E B0C8 FD55 A072 | http://the-compiler.org/pubkey.asc
>         I love long mails! | http://email.is-not-s.ms/




From tomas at orsava.cz  Fri Mar 11 11:53:49 2016
From: tomas at orsava.cz (=?UTF-8?B?VG9tw6HFoSBPcnNhdmE=?=)
Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2016 11:53:49 +0100
Subject: Remapping Escape
In-Reply-To: <20160311053829.GP11428@tonks>
References: <CAOkyep7L0i+72G8SO9y+4-LBLR8wz8u9qhVHER__T1BTap4vzQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <20160311053829.GP11428@tonks>
Message-ID: <CAOkyep7ibATGM644RtTK7+sbUAE90HgbZE=FJRa7LkTsAGq6xQ@mail.gmail.com>

>
> I just mapped capslock to esc via xmodmap ;)
>

I have mapped capslock to Ctrl a long time ago, best decision I ever made :)
I might look into mapping Ctrl to Escape though.


> You can currently only bind special chars (i.e. non-alphanumeric ones,
> or involving a modifier) in insert mode, yeah.
>
> There is an issue for it though:
> https://github.com/The-Compiler/qutebrowser/issues/1044


How hard do you think it would be to implement that? I'm asking for a
friend. :D

Tom
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From ryan at rcorre.net  Fri Mar 11 22:17:19 2016
From: ryan at rcorre.net (Ryan Roden-Corrent)
Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2016 16:17:19 -0500
Subject: qutebrowser and Github
In-Reply-To: <20160311064919.sjmt4gr4sfsdmndo@chris-XPS13-9333-work>
References: <20160311020843.GA554@zen-arch> <20160311053605.GO11428@tonks>
 <20160311064919.sjmt4gr4sfsdmndo@chris-XPS13-9333-work>
Message-ID: <20160311211719.GA1054@desktop-arch.nc.rr.com>

Thanks! Switching user-agent back to the default seems to help.
I can't remember why I changed it in the first place.

On Fri 03/11/16 03:49PM, Chris Salzberg wrote:
> FWIW, I found that if I set my user-agent to the default github sort of
> works, but still it's really sluggish when switching tabs and I find I often
> have to reload the page to see what I want to see.
> 
> It's annoying that companies like Github who should know better make their
> interface so dependent on your user-agent...
> 
> Looking forward to QtWebEngine!!! ;)
> 
> On 03/11 at 06:36, Florian Bruhin wrote:
> >* Ryan Roden-Corrent <ryan at rcorre.net> [2016-03-10 21:08:43 -0500]:
> >>I remember a while back a mail went around about qutebrowser having trouble with
> >>Github's web UI. Has anyone tried contacting their support about this? I did,
> >>and was told they couldn't repro it. I just waited figuring the problem would
> >>sort itself out eventually, but it still hasn't. In particular, I need to launch
> >>chromium every time I want to open a PR because the buttons and dropdowns don't
> >>work in qutebrowser. For those that weren't following this, there _was_ a time
> >>when it worked, but it hasn't for a while (months, maybe?).
> >
> >After some people contacted support, it worked again after a few
> >days - but only if you set your user-agent to the default.
> >
> >Not sure what weird stuff they do, but things are going to get better
> >with QtWebEngine in the future either way.
> >
> >Florian
> >
> >-- 
> >http://www.the-compiler.org | me at the-compiler.org (Mail/XMPP)
> >  GPG: 916E B0C8 FD55 A072 | http://the-compiler.org/pubkey.asc
> >        I love long mails! | http://email.is-not-s.ms/
> 
> 


From me at rmz.io  Tue Mar 15 12:18:29 2016
From: me at rmz.io (Samir Benmendil)
Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2016 11:18:29 +0000
Subject: Remapping Escape
In-Reply-To: <CAOkyep7ibATGM644RtTK7+sbUAE90HgbZE=FJRa7LkTsAGq6xQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAOkyep7L0i+72G8SO9y+4-LBLR8wz8u9qhVHER__T1BTap4vzQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <20160311053829.GP11428@tonks>
 <CAOkyep7ibATGM644RtTK7+sbUAE90HgbZE=FJRa7LkTsAGq6xQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20160315111829.GA753@sb-arch.lan>

On Mar 11, 2016 at 11:53, Tom?? Orsava wrote:
>> I just mapped capslock to esc via xmodmap ;)
> I have mapped capslock to Ctrl a long time ago, best decision I ever 
> made :)
> I might look into mapping Ctrl to Escape though.
You can have both: https://github.com/alols/xcape

I managed to set this up on OSX as well using Karabiner, and on Windows 
using AutoHotKey. Although with some lag/issues IIRC.
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From me at the-compiler.org  Fri Mar 18 15:28:53 2016
From: me at the-compiler.org (Florian Bruhin)
Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2016 15:28:53 +0100
Subject: New qutebrowser-ML subscriptions
Message-ID: <20160318142853.GR11428@tonks>

Hey!

I noticed a lot of new subscriptions to the ML today/yesterday, and a
spike in GitHub traffic and new people in IRC - however I have no idea
why, and got curious.

How did you all find qutebrowser? Is it in some Linux magazine or
something I'm not aware of yet? ;)

Florian

-- 
http://www.the-compiler.org | me at the-compiler.org (Mail/XMPP)
   GPG: 916E B0C8 FD55 A072 | http://the-compiler.org/pubkey.asc
         I love long mails! | http://email.is-not-s.ms/
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From rumpelsepp at sevenbyte.org  Fri Mar 18 15:44:30 2016
From: rumpelsepp at sevenbyte.org (Stefan Tatschner)
Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2016 15:44:30 +0100
Subject: New qutebrowser-ML subscriptions
In-Reply-To: <20160318142853.GR11428@tonks>
References: <20160318142853.GR11428@tonks>
Message-ID: <7C983873-6C04-4281-B0D5-3D56515CAA83@sevenbyte.org>

Is it spam or  real people? :D

On March 18, 2016 3:28:53 PM GMT+01:00, Florian Bruhin <me at the-compiler.org> wrote:
>Hey!
>
>I noticed a lot of new subscriptions to the ML today/yesterday, and a
>spike in GitHub traffic and new people in IRC - however I have no idea
>why, and got curious.
>
>How did you all find qutebrowser? Is it in some Linux magazine or
>something I'm not aware of yet? ;)
>
>Florian
>
>-- 
>http://www.the-compiler.org | me at the-compiler.org (Mail/XMPP)
>   GPG: 916E B0C8 FD55 A072 | http://the-compiler.org/pubkey.asc
>         I love long mails! | http://email.is-not-s.ms/

-- 
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
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From me at the-compiler.org  Fri Mar 18 23:27:15 2016
From: me at the-compiler.org (Florian Bruhin)
Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2016 23:27:15 +0100
Subject: PSA: Don't upgrade to Qt 5.6 with Homebrew on OS X
Message-ID: <20160318222715.GX11428@tonks>

Hey,

Homebrew apparently decided to not package QtWebKit with Qt 5.6
anymore: https://github.com/Homebrew/homebrew/pull/50234

I'll figure out what to do about this later(tm) - for now, please
don't upgrade your packages.

If someone has an idea what the best way to solve this is, please let
me know.

Florian

-- 
http://www.the-compiler.org | me at the-compiler.org (Mail/XMPP)
   GPG: 916E B0C8 FD55 A072 | http://the-compiler.org/pubkey.asc
         I love long mails! | http://email.is-not-s.ms/
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From z1693060 at students.niu.edu  Sun Mar 20 01:41:51 2016
From: z1693060 at students.niu.edu (Abraham Baker)
Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2016 19:41:51 -0500
Subject: Gmail support?
Message-ID: <CAJkSvUqwWFkVgJpzvttEL2foExV0RHexkwnBxf=wXjcJG1Jv-w@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

I'm using the stable arch version of qutebrowser (0.5.1,
https://www.archlinux.org/packages/?name=qutebrowser), and a few days ago I
started seeing a message at the top of the gmail interface saying:
"This version of Safari is no longer supported. Please upgrade to a
supported browser."

Does anybody know if this just applies to .5.1, or if gmail is displaying
this notice on every version of qutebrowser?  This does not break any
functionality, but it seems strange.

Thanks,
Abe
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From ryan at rcorre.net  Sun Mar 20 01:56:41 2016
From: ryan at rcorre.net (Ryan Roden-Corrent)
Date: Sat, 19 Mar 2016 20:56:41 -0400
Subject: Gmail support?
In-Reply-To: <CAJkSvUqwWFkVgJpzvttEL2foExV0RHexkwnBxf=wXjcJG1Jv-w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJkSvUqwWFkVgJpzvttEL2foExV0RHexkwnBxf=wXjcJG1Jv-w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20160320005641.GA3837@desktop-arch.nc.rr.com>

I see it too (0.5.1, Archlinux).
It goes away if you change the user agent from the default. 
Try :set network user-agent and tab through the suggestions.
I've found this is actually necessary to use google hangouts.
Unfortunately, a non-default user-agent breaks a lot of the Github UI.

-Ryan

On Sat 03/19/16 07:41PM, Abraham Baker wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> I'm using the stable arch version of qutebrowser (0.5.1,
> https://www.archlinux.org/packages/?name=qutebrowser), and a few days ago I
> started seeing a message at the top of the gmail interface saying:
> "This version of Safari is no longer supported. Please upgrade to a
> supported browser."
> 
> Does anybody know if this just applies to .5.1, or if gmail is displaying
> this notice on every version of qutebrowser?  This does not break any
> functionality, but it seems strange.
> 
> Thanks,
> Abe


From me at the-compiler.org  Sun Mar 20 12:33:30 2016
From: me at the-compiler.org (Florian Bruhin)
Date: Sun, 20 Mar 2016 12:33:30 +0100
Subject: Gmail support?
In-Reply-To: <20160320005641.GA3837@desktop-arch.nc.rr.com>
 <CAJkSvUqwWFkVgJpzvttEL2foExV0RHexkwnBxf=wXjcJG1Jv-w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20160320113330.GA11428@tonks>

Hey,

* Abraham Baker <z1693060 at students.niu.edu> [2016-03-19 19:41:51 -0500]:
> I'm using the stable arch version of qutebrowser (0.5.1,
> https://www.archlinux.org/packages/?name=qutebrowser), and a few days ago I
> started seeing a message at the top of the gmail interface saying:
> "This version of Safari is no longer supported. Please upgrade to a
> supported browser."
> 
> Does anybody know if this just applies to .5.1, or if gmail is displaying
> this notice on every version of qutebrowser?  This does not break any
> functionality, but it seems strange.

A couple of websites do that, and as Ryan said - changing the UA
works, but breaks other pages.

* Ryan Roden-Corrent <ryan at rcorre.net> [2016-03-19 20:56:41 -0400]:
> I see it too (0.5.1, Archlinux).
> It goes away if you change the user agent from the default. 
> Try :set network user-agent and tab through the suggestions.
> I've found this is actually necessary to use google hangouts.
> Unfortunately, a non-default user-agent breaks a lot of the Github UI.

Let's add this to the pile of issues which will be fixed by per-domain
settings[1] and/or the QtWebEngine backend[2].

[1] https://github.com/The-Compiler/qutebrowser/issues/27
[2] https://github.com/The-Compiler/qutebrowser/issues/666

Florian

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From me at the-compiler.org  Wed Mar 23 11:30:02 2016
From: me at the-compiler.org (Florian Bruhin)
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2016 11:30:02 +0100
Subject: QtWebEngine crowdfunding launched!
Message-ID: <20160323103002.GJ11428@tonks>

Hi!

A few weeks ago, I posted a request-for-comments about starting a crowdfunding
for QtWebEngine support in qutebrowser.

I got a lot of positive feedback, and I'm happy to announce the campaign just
went live!

You can find it here: http://igg.me/at/qutebrowser

In case you're one of the few persons who haven't heard me saying "your issue
will be solved by QtWebEngine" - here is a short explanation of what's going
on:

qutebrowser is currently using QtWebKit, which is based on an outdated version
of the WebKit rendering engine. This comes with various stability, performance
and security issues.

QtWebKit also got removed from Qt 5.6, which means qutebrowser could break when
a distribution stops shipping it, like it happened a few days ago with Homebrew
on OS X.

The goal of the campaign is to add support for QtWebEngine to qutebrowser.
QtWebEngine is based on Chromium and in very active development - support for
it will fix dozens of qutebrowser bugs related to QtWebKit.

Since this is a lot of work, I plan to work on it full-time for a month, or
even longer if possible. I'd really appreciate your help!

Thanks!

Florian

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From me at the-compiler.org  Thu Mar 24 22:37:24 2016
From: me at the-compiler.org (Florian Bruhin)
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2016 22:37:24 +0100
Subject: [qutebrowser] QtWebEngine crowdfunding launched!
In-Reply-To: <20160323103002.GJ11428@tonks>
References: <20160323103002.GJ11428@tonks>
Message-ID: <20160324213724.GA11428@tonks>

Hey,

* Florian Bruhin <me at the-compiler.org> [2016-03-23 11:30:02 +0100]:
> I got a lot of positive feedback, and I'm happy to announce the campaign just
> went live!

As some of you probably noticed, the crowdfunding went very well in
the first few hours, quickly raising ?2000 of the original ?3000 goal!

I'm really happy about this, but let's hope it doesn't stop there!
?3000 is what I need to work on qutebrowser for one month, but now I'm
hoping it'll be two rather than one, i.e. 6000?.

There's almost a month to go for the funding, so everything is
possible :)

People (including me, but not just :P) have been posting various
threads on Reddit, Hackernews and Slashdot:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Python/comments/4bou9b/
https://www.reddit.com/r/opensource/comments/4bosnm/
https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxmasterrace/comments/4bmovz/
https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/4bmm4t/
https://www.reddit.com/r/archlinux/comments/4briol/
https://www.reddit.com/r/vim/comments/4bm294/

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11355418
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11353366
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11352467

https://slashdot.org/submission/5704787/

If you have an account there (or don't mind creating one), please
upvote those, as it could make a big difference!

Thank you!

Florian

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